Backtalkers, unite. 
The Kool Aid references, while funny, aren’t really apt in my case. To suggest that someone is drinking Kool Aid is to suggest that they are lemmings, following the masses. In point of fact, I am the one who is outside of the box, here. Nonetheless, as long as you’re here, we might as well talk….
Rick Maese, of the Baltimore Sun echoes some of my sentinments, albeit a tad more eloquently. Here’s a taste:
…. Before we put both feet through this looking-glass of absurdity, let’s go on record with a few things: Bonds is more likely a jerk, not a pariah….. Consider this: The longest-running grand jury investigation into clerical abuse ran for three years. It revealed hundreds of children had been abused by 63 priests over a 35-year period. With yesterday’s indictment, in four years’ time, all we’ve learned is that Bonds isn’t the best role model and he might not be very truthful. That’s not a good return on our investment. In fact, I suspect if you devoted four years to similarly focused crusades, we might learn that much of corporate America, a good chunk of the legal world and many of our elected officials are guilty of similar character crimes.
Exactly. If you investigated anybody for four years, virtually unfettered by decency, with unlimited resources and a right-wing White House backing you the whole way, you could come up with something. Bonds didn’t obstruct the BALCO investigation. They got their indictment, got their conviction, Anderson and Conte got jail time, paid their fines, paid their dues. If you were asked to testify against a cocaine dealer and you lied to save our job, and the dealer got indicted and convicted anyway, there’s almost no chance that the DA would go after you for doing so. It wouldn’t be worth the money, it wouldn’t be worth the risk of losing a difficult perjury case, it wouldn’t warrant attention.
Bonds was, in fact, singled out, because he was an asshole who broke the home run records, a black man who acted like he was the best, the biggest and baddest man in the room. He was insulting and demeaning and rude and pretty much got what he wanted, did what he wanted, for twenty years or more. So, yeah, petty jealousy, inflamed sensibilities, and maybe a little racism thrown in for good measure; all of these things and more contributed to this effort to get him, to take him down a notch, to show him who’s really boss.
If you are on board with that, you’re the one drinking the Kool Aid. You’re the one who thinks that everything the man in charge says is right, that everything is black and white; that it’s easy to say Bonds is bad, and you don’t care about whether the entire league should be under the microscope. You don’t care that players like Paul Byrd, or noted good guy, gamer of the decade Matt Williams also seem to have been involved, or that it’s been mostly pitchers that have tested positive, or that maybe, just maybe, players were encouraged to do whatever they could to win by management, by ownership, or even the commissioner.
And let’s be clear, the home run binge that started pretty much when everyone came back from the strike saved baseball. McGwire and Sosa brought the game back into the public spotlight, with each player’s individual at-bats cutting into other sports live coverage as the season went on. You think Seligula thought it was bad at the time? You think the owners of the Twins and the Royals thought it was terrible as their revenue sharing sclice went for $1 million a season to $20 million? You want to put an asterisk on Bonds, you better start giving back wins for the Giants, start changing everyone’s stats. If you’re gonna strike Bonds’ records, that means all of the pitchers he victimized, the 400-plus guys who served up his home runs, all of those guys get a break, don’t they? What about all the merchandise? What about all the advertising revenue?
If McGwire’s such a pariah, why don’t you go ask the Busch family to give back all the money they made in ’98? Baseball’s revenue’s just passed $6 billion, you think maybe the home run chases that captivated the nation in ’98 had a little to do with that? You think the House that Bonds built –and the extra 2 million fans per year that went there– maybe contributed a little? You bet your ass.So now we’re gonna hang Bonds. Good for you, good for all of you. Tell me this isn’t appropriate: 
I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way….
You fuckin’ people. You have no idea how to defend a nation. All you did was weaken a country today, Kaffee. That’s all you did. You put people’s lives in danger. Sweet dreams, son.
UPDATE: Here’s the link to my interview. Let me know if it sounds OK.
i asked an client of mine, who happens to be an atty, what he thought about the case
he said that if they file multiple charges of perjury, the dont have a strong case, and are hoping to hit paydirt with one
the fact remains, this case was brought to embarress bonds and destroy him in the court of public opinion
and Hobbes2d, unless bonds took roids after it was banned by the mlb, what he may have done was possibly immoral…but it wasnt cheating
out of all sports, baseball is the least pure…cheating…errrrr….getting an edge…has always been a part of the game
John: I’ve been told that you and I share Kool-Aid together. A vodka tonic…maybe???
The Govt thinks he didn’t testify truthfully before the GJ like the others called. That was the deal he agreed to and you break those at your peril.
And btw John, he sure as shit DID admit to taking the cream and clear.
No, one again you show your bias. Barry admitted to taking arthritic balm and flaxseed oil. He never admitted that he either believed then or believes now that these were actually the steroids commonly refered to as the cream and the clear.
As I recall, he admitted that the stuff he used was “a cream” and “a clear”, which are not necessarily “the cream” and “the clear” in question (although most have already concluded that they must be the same).
you know, there’s some truth in Frank’s sarcasm – there has to be a point at which personal freedoms, rights to one’s own person, are important. John, in his main article, talks about the 3 year grand jury re: priests. How in the world does Bonds compare to that? WHY does anybody really care? For god sakes, the man (presumably) consumed a drug that had absolutely no negative effect on society whatsoever – nor got him high, nothing. There is absolutely no victim here, unless it’s our “faith in the national pastime” – puhleaze. And yet the Feds spend all that money (and I would call $10 million conservative), violate a Union agreement, infiltrate MLB where they HAVE made efforts to change the situation (though I’m not naive) – so, if I go to my local police station and tell them that four years ago I took some illegal drugs, and only had an amount for personal use, they would throw me out for wasting their time.
What right do they even have to do this in the first place? The police can’t just come into your workplace and test for illegal drugs. What, was Barry driving a forklift in his off hours? The naivete and tolerance surrounding this is truly appalling. Of course it’s because he’s a grumpy, nonrepentant black man. And of course it’s because the Feds have gotten in over their heads. Four years! You would think by now they even know about those library books that Barry returned late 3 years ago. If the man failed to tip a waiter, had a broken taillight, used the name of the lord in vain, or failed to open the door for an old lady, they know. And it took FOUR YEARS to indict – the Feds have nothing. The prosecutor just wants to be on TV, on mine and your tax dollars.
Who gives a shit about Barry this is old news. We all know he cheated and anybody who’s been following this case knows that the Government pretty much has no case. I would be shocked if he was found guilty of anything.
Now in much better news the Giants are supposedly aggressively pursuing Miguel Cabrera, and Tim Lincecum is likely to be the main target. I say go for it. Miguel is 24, 25 in April and is a HOF level talent. He already is halfway to 1000 RBI’s.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/rumors/post/Giants-aggressively-pursuing-Florida-s-Cabrera?urn=mlb,54073
Of course it depends on the details of the swap, but in general I say go for it… and here’s why: it is my belief that a talented hitter and position player is a far safer long term bet than a pitcher. Yes, hitters go into funks now and then, but the talented ones almost always pull out of it and remain productive players. Pitchers, however, often hit a wall and suddenly become ineffective. Not that I believe this will happen to Lincecum, but we do have some other young talent and could really use a guy like Cabrera.
My only concern is, perhaps we could have the chance to negotiation a longer contract with Cabrera before pulling the trigger. I’d hate to give up Lincecum in exchange for 2 years of Cabrera and then he walks away as a free agent.
My goodness, people. Are we really reduced to calling each other names? I’ve had more thoughtful debates in my high school classes, and I work with “troubled” kids in a continuation school! Barry is the one who is supposed to be the immature asshole–let’s see if we can argue like men, OK? John has, indeed, written more intelligent and thoughtful arguments on baseball and PEDs (and Barry) than anyone else. I think that is a given. If you can’t abide by his conclusions, then construct a rebuttal. I happen to share John’s thought on this, namely, that this indictment is a shameful abuse of power. It is really about “comeuppance” for an arrogant prick. Do I think telling lies to a grand jury is a criminal offense? Certainly. Do I think four years of machinations to “catch” him in an alleged lie is a worthy use of the federal justice system? Absolutely not. I am not able to divine the intentions of the prosecutors and their bosses, but this effort does seem to be about “putting someone in his place” than about the law, or about justice. It smacks of political posturing. If Barry were a white man, I think he *may* have suffered the same fate, but the fact that he is a black man makes things easier and more palatable to the public. Yes, that is the “race card,” which I hate to “play,” but it seems unavoidable in this case. I’m a little bewildered by all the attention PEDs get, I have a feeling we’ll be laughing about the hysteria in 20 years. This reminds me quite a bit of the crazy over-reaction to marijuana use many years ago. Now we have states essentially legalizing the stuff. But that’s a bit off-track. In the end, what is Barry’s crime? He took some drugs and lied about it, assuming the federal case is “true.” Wow. What is that worth? A few months in jail? Really? Seems like relatively innocuous private behavior, hardly worthy of a multi-million dollar federal effort. No one lost money. No one got hurt. No property was damaged. In fact, Barry did some damn good business for his employers, every dollar spent on him was returned 10-fold! Damn, I’m going to miss watching him. No one electrified an at-bat like Barry, sometimes I felt like the world stopped turning while I watched or listened to him at the plate. Them’s the breaks, I guess.
RUFS…, (and, yes, I would say you are), I apologize for not submitting my comment for your approval
What a dope.
John, I must part ways with you on this one. I think, behind Iraq/Afganistan, Barry Bond’s likely use of steroids is the most important issue facing our country. While you complain about the millions of dollars spent on this investigation, it is really costing us nothing because we will be paying for it with moneys we get from Iraqi oil. And if that money isn’t forthcoming, well, then this investigation will distract us.
Personally, I think this issue is far more serious than any two bit (Enron) CEO gutting his companies pension plan or stock price. I mean, them are the breaks. But cheating at baseball? Unheard of. The survival of the western world is at stake. It has to stop, no matter how many millions it costs. This is probably the most important crisis since Jack Johnson in the early 20th century. So, I suggest you ahve a little more faith in your government. I mean, you’re probably one of those guys who (mistakenly) believe that they fudged on the case for war against Iraq. And, yes, Mr. Smartypants, there are WMD buried in Iraq somewhere.
Red fucking herring, Frank.
Believe what you want, Frank.
Bush, Cheney and the rest of those mothefuckers lied about Iraq, and have obfuscated, lied, distorted facts, broken promise after promise, are responisble for the deaths of countless Americans, the bancrupcy of maybe millions, the poverty, cultural and financial, of socres of our countrymen, and should be in jail.
Bonds took PED’s to hit home runs. Not for nothing, but you’ve gotta be kidding me.
John,
I think you have your sarcasism meter turned off. Turn it back on an re-read Frank’s post.
Really? LOL, I feel like an idot. Sorry, Frank.
john….after listening to the podcast, i have learned one thing
YOU NEED A BETTER FUCKING PHONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
oh, and you are wrong about what a private test means
if bonds failed the test given by balco, and that is what the gov is hanging their hats on…there aint no case
according to conte, he got a deal on the tests because they were not handled in the proper fashion
the tests werent meant to indict a player…only to determine if suplements taken also had ped’s in them
there aint no fuckin case
and bonds never failed a ped test given by the mlb…except for greenies…and guess what…aaron lived on those little pills
i may be the lead kool-aid drinker….but here is what we know
the “positive tests” alluded to in the idictment, refer to testing…..done at balco…and under less than pristine conditions, and apparently not handled very well by the testing lab, in order for conte to save money
the gov cannot put on the stand either bell or novitsky…bonds’ atty’s will have a field day with them
anderson still wont testify…the government has pretty much destroyed his life, and the dude is pissed
so i still think the case will go nowhere, but i do believe this is the end of barry’s career
John: the link required more than the usual amount of buffering time for me,but could be my connection
Faye Vincent,LOL, Another stink Selig wished was not around passively aggresively continually silently farting on him.
Another LOL, the media now hailing the new king Arod, while a week ago annoiting him the most insincere of all athletes
Barry haters being caught on tape at their home ballpark,booing Barry, secretly wishing he would hit a hr. Barry hits a hr. they cheer for 2 or 3 seconds because they got what they wanted,then click back to I am suppose to be booing LOL.
Regardless what happens in the future with the indictment,no player in my middle aged life has entertained ,pumped up a stadium and gave the fans their moneys worth as Barry Lamar Bonds.
The TMZ 30 society we live in will not wish to admit this, today ,but they will miss Barry and the passion he inspired in them.
[...] pinto@baseballmusings.com (David Pinto) created a sweet baseball article today.Here’s a mini excerpt.And let’s be clear, the home run binge that started pretty much when everyone came back from the strike saved baseball. McGwire and Sosa brought the game back into the public spotlight, with each player’s individual at-bats cutting into … [...]
On yet another note, I find this quote from Conte to be very revealing…
“I certainly haven’t seen all the evidence in Barry’s case,” Conte said in an e-mail to the Mercury News. “However, I’ve seen a lot of it and I just don’t think there’s enough to meet the standard of reasonable doubt,” he said. “They say it’s possible to indict a ham sandwich and, unfortunately, I think it’s going to take a very long time for us to find out if that’s what they’ve done.”
Keep in mind that Conte knows exactly what was taken from his offices during the raids, so he’s privy to a huge chunk of the evidence. Of all the people making comments on the indictment, I find his the most telling.
To suggest that someone is drinking Kool Aid is to suggest that they are lemmings, following the masses.
No, it means that person is drinking acid-laced Kool-Aid (see Ken Kesey) or an unthinking member of a kooky Jim Jones-like cult. Doesn’t have the meaning you suggest. You could look it up. Nice try, lawyer.
Sure, maybe in the 1960′s – 1980′s, but more often these days when someone says don’t drink the kool-aid it’s used in exactly the way John is saying. As in, just believing what someone tells you without question… and applying it to John makes no sense because in terms of defending Bonds, there is no “they” to speak of.
It suggest blindly following an idiot cult leader: sort of like you guys and John.
RUFN Stoopid,
Why are you here?
Just tryin’ to keep you honets, John. Just tryin’ to keep you honest.
Thanks, but no thanks. Go keep someone else honest. You don’t like what I write, I could give a shit, but its sure seems like a waste of your time to come here to insult me and my readers.
You wanna contribute, do yourself a favor and read something and come at me with facts. Right now, you sound like a dick, no offense, who just wants to insult someone who doesn’t think like they do. I’ve been writing about this for five years, and I think my overall contribution is a lot more measured and thoughtful than you would seem to have any idea about.
Have you been reading me for five years? Have you followed the BALCO and Bonds situation from day one? I’ve written tens of thousands of words on the subject, read and compiled one of the most comprehensive steroids and baseball link sections anywhere on the web, emailed and dialogued with countless doping experts and legal writers, and yes, read Game of Shadows, among the hundreds of books I’ve read on everything baseball and otherwise in the last couple of years.
When are you gonna offer something thoughtful and measured to the dialogue?
You just proved my point. If John is the cult leader, he can’t be the one drinking the kool-aid.
If you remember, Jim Jones lead and joined his cult in drinking the ‘cool-aid’ that lead to all of their deaths.
*sigh* … yes, I’m aware of that, but my whole point was that John’s use of “drinking the kool-aid” was correct in a modern context.
That’s ok. If being a libertarian and believing that this witch hunt against Barry Bonds (and to a much lessor extent other accused steroid users) is a cult with John as a leader then you can count me in as a member of the ‘cult’ too.
Here’s what I don’t understand about all of this… If the supposed failed drug test is indeed from the 2003 batch, which was promised to remain anonymous, why isn’t the player’s union shitting a brick? Not that they should feel the need to step up for someone like Bonds, but the basic principle of violating that guaranteed anonymity is a MAJOR, MAJOR violation of the contract. Gene Upshaw should be threatening to strike before the season. Am I missing something?
Anyway, in general I agree that the hypocracy with all of this is staggering. My money says that this indictment was a save-face job by the grand jury and investigators, who felt pressured to at least throw out some sort of indictment after spending all of that time, money and resources, even though they know it won’t stick. That’s just my guess, and I say that because any lawyer knows how incredibly difficult it is to prove a perjury case.
On another note: if all of the targets in the BALCO case were already convicted, it’s going to be tough to prove that Bonds’ obstruction of justice had any consequences (this is important particularly when it comes to sentencing).
Finally, a few months back Bonds’ attorney Michael Reins alluded to the fact that he was privy to some major info about the investigation, and now he’s doing more of the same. It’s hard to imagine what kind of dirt or information he has, but man it would be hilarious if this blows up in the grand jury’s face. I hope so, if only to make them look bad for wasting so many tax dollars on something so pointless. Sure, Bonds probably took a bunch of junk, but who the hell really gives a shit in the big-picture of things?
Okay, so it’s probably a different test sample… that makes more sense.
[...] funny, arent really apt in my case. To suggest that someone is drinking Kool Aid is to source: . Talk talk, Only Baseball [...]
[...] Original post here [...]
And there you go again with your stupid, fuckin’ race card trick. What a failure of imagination.
What a maroon. You make almost no sense. Put down the crack pipe.
Never insult someone with a word you can’t spell correctly, it kind of undermines your authority in the argument.
Never insult someone with a word you can’t spell correctly, it kind of undermines your authority in the argument.
That was intentional, fuckhead. You’ve never heard that expression? What a maroon.
“What a maroon” is a stupid fucking expression that’s rarely used any longer (for good reason due to its racist origins). I’d guess most people assumed you meant to type “What a Moron”, particularly since you also used crack pipe in the same post. So yeah, my mistake.
It comes from Bugs Bunny, you dumb fuck. I can see that you, like John, are fond of playing the race card without a basis in fact. Tsk. And what are you implying about crack and race? I know you are unable to spell “hypocrisy,” but, Jesus H, are you fucking retarded?
Now you’re just going on like a blathering idiot (crack and race, WTF?). Oh, and bugs bunny didn’t make up the expression (he did make it more popular though) — there’s no race card to play, it’s just a fact (look it up if you don’t believe me).